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Cal Men's Basketball Fouled By Beavers, 92-85

Sounded like an exciting 1st half. Sounded like a disappointing 2nd half. Are road woes become a Cal theme?

Did we get jobbed by the refs? How cool was it that Solo was able to play again?

We couldn't stop a 5'9 guard from dropping 3's all over on us. We couldn't stop an Aussie center from dropping 3's all over us. The refs apparently confused Jared Cunningham for an NBA All-Star and gave him the Jordan treatment whenever he drove towards the basket.

Jorge showed up big, but we didn't enough shots for our bigs and needed a lot more production out of Allen Crabbe. Besides Solo, it sounded like we didn't get a lot out of our bench. And once again, backup point guard is becoming a concern against pressure and teams with athletic defenders.

This is your post-game thread. Grouse, vent, and talk about the game here.

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Player of the Year discussion here

Gutierrez: 26 pts, 3 rebs, 4 assists
Cunningham: 24 pts, 1 reb, 5 assists, AND THE VICTORY.

From the mouth of Todd McKim, Cunningham drew every foul on Cal in the 2nd half and we had no answer defensively for him.

So, advantage Cunningham. But Gut did a great job of outscoring him, which will show up in the final season stats – a gap he needs to close!

by concordtom on Jan 5, 2012 9:08 PM PST reply actions  

Jorge’s only chance of winning POY is Cal winning the conference. So he has a decent shot at it.

The #1 greatest threat to America: BEARS

by norcalnick on Jan 5, 2012 9:09 PM PST up reply actions  

Cunningham was bailed out by the refs. no thanks, he still can’t play D.

no bear, no care

by EchoOfSilence on Jan 5, 2012 9:10 PM PST up reply actions  

FWIW, Cunningham leads the conference in steals, though it’s true that OSU’s team defense is probably pretty bad.

The #1 greatest threat to America: BEARS

by norcalnick on Jan 5, 2012 9:19 PM PST up reply actions  

Cunningham played well....

….he drove the lane and put the ball in the basket. It was odd, though; Cal help would come to the hole but then NOT block his shot. Seemed they could have contested several of his drives, but maybe we were worried about the refs. In 2nd half they called everything for OSU.

Frustrating loss……

I'd like to smell the Roses before I die.

by BTown85 on Jan 5, 2012 11:15 PM PST up reply actions  

FYI: JORGE IS MY Pac-12 POY

I realize it’s early in the season for such talk, and I’m just a bit more than biased, but I’m thinking it’ll be hard to convince me to vote for anyone else other than Jorge for conference Player of the Year.

I went to the stats to support my bias, knowing it’s not entirely favorable for him, but I don’t care! Gut is certainly the most important player on Cal, and if Cal is able to win the conference, then Gut is my guy!

http://www.pac-12.org/portals/7/images/MBasketball/2011-12-stats/HTML/CONFLDRS.HTM

Scoring:
1. OSU’s Cunningham @ 17.0
2. UW’s Wroten @ 16.8
3. Cal’s Crabbe @ 15.9
9. Jorge @ 13.9
15. Ore’s Garrett Sim @ 12.8 (Gut’s spot opened when Sim bailed on Cal)

Rebounds:
15. Cal’s Kravish @ 5.9
17. Cal’s Crabbe @ 5.7
20. Cal’s Kamp @ 5.3

Assists:
1. WSU’s Moore @ 5.64
2. Utah’s Watkins @ 5.08
3. UW’s Gaddy @ 5.08
4. Cal’s Cobbs @ 4.6
5. Jorge @ 4.21

FT%
7. Jorge @ 81.4%

Steals:
1. OSU’s Cunningham @ 2.93
13. Jorge @ 1.29

Assist to Turnover Ratio:
1. UW’s Gaddy @ 2.87
2. UCLA’s Anderson @ 2.42
3. Cal’s Cobbs @ 2.3
4. Cal’s Smith @ 2.0
8. Jorge @ 1.59

Defensive Rebounds:
9. Cal’s Crabbe @ 4.6
10. Jorge @ 4.5

A few thoughts.
1) Nobody brings the all everything, leadership, consistency, selflessness, and competitive intensity that gets his team going that Jorge Gutierrez brings.
2) Crabbe is scoring and rebounding at a greater clip than Jorge. However, Jorge is in constant motion, driving the lane, collapsing the defense, and passing out to Crabbe’s open 3’s. Jorge’s movement creates shots for everyone on the team, including himself. He is also always guarding the other teams’ best guards on a nightly basis.
3) Jorge has toned down his defense in a positive way. Before, he’d go all out, excessively, getting himself into foul trouble, throwing him off his game a bit. Maybe he’d get a technical, maybe he’d just have to be calmed down on the bench. He’s not doing any of those excessive roughness fouls, and that is appreciated. He can still have the defensive impact without all that, but we need his offense so much more now, that he’s needed to balance out the D with O.
4) Jorge is not in the Top 10 in minutes played (31.6 and above) and that’s a great sign for the future of our season. We don’t want him getting burned out. Much appreciated, Brandon Smith!

I admit, it may be a bit of a tall order for Jorge to get the votes with his scoring being 9th, below 14 per game. Voters undoubtably flock to the highest scorers. Candidates would be Cunningham at OSU, if they can finish high enough in the standings. If UW finishes top 3, voters could lean toward one of 3 scorers (Wroten; CJ Wilcox 15.3, 4th; or T. Ross, 14.4, 8th). Arizona’s leading scorer is Solomon Hill at 12.1 (21st), so forget about them, though Hill is 3rd in rebounding. Similarly, Stanford’s Owens is 20th at 12.4/gm. The other 3 scorers ahead of Jorge come from Utah, USC, and WSU, teams that won’t finish high enough to be considered. Crabbe could also take Jorge votes away if Cal finishes high in the standings. There’s a good chance he could catch fire down the stretch and increase his scoring by a good margin. Still, I’m siding with Jorge for overall contribution.

Basically, let’s say it’s a 3 team (OSU, UW, CAL) and 6 player (Cunningham, Wroten, Wilcox, Ross, Crabbe, Jorge) race for Pac-12 POY! Well, I’ll throw in Hill of Arizona in there – it could happen. He could finish 2nd in boards and 10 spots higher in scoring with not much changing. He also is 13th in assists at 3.36. Well, nah. It’s all Jorge, baby! A little more scoring, a couple signature games, and a conference title and he’s there. That’s a long ways from his freshman year, from his recruitment announcement, from Chihuahua.

Hip, hip, Jorge!

by concordtom on Jan 5, 2012 9:11 PM PST up reply actions  

I think it’s a little silly that standings should be so important to POY.

"i, for one, welcome our new atomic overlords" - GoldBlooded

by atomsareenough on Jan 5, 2012 9:47 PM PST up reply actions  

It’s going to work against Jorge that Cal has a few players making similar contributions as opposed to one player appearing to carry the load. Basketball voters love the individual carrying a team storyline, even if it’s not really true (see Rose, Derrick)…

by Missing Barry on Jan 5, 2012 11:39 PM PST up reply actions  

Ahmad Starks and Joe Burton have been pretty solid contributors for OSU, probably more so than Crabbe or Kamp. Devon Collier also has played pretty well.

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 6, 2012 12:09 AM PST up reply actions  

Beat Oregon and it’s a ‘meh’ week.

The #1 greatest threat to America: BEARS

by norcalnick on Jan 5, 2012 9:09 PM PST reply actions  

i dunno, Oregon’s damn athletic. that’d be good

no bear, no care

by EchoOfSilence on Jan 5, 2012 9:11 PM PST up reply actions  

They aren’t as good as OSU, and we should be a reasonable favorite, but I’m not sure there’s a lot of margin for error in that game. A sweep would set us back a ton in conference, so we need to get it done.

by Reef on Jan 5, 2012 9:17 PM PST up reply actions  

Also Kamp, Kravish, and Smith got beat up a bit in this game. I hope they’re feeling good by Sunday.

"i, for one, welcome our new atomic overlords" - GoldBlooded

by atomsareenough on Jan 5, 2012 9:35 PM PST up reply actions  

For once, it’s nice to get that extra day off.

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 5, 2012 9:37 PM PST up reply actions  

Good news, Bad news

The bad: poorest defensive performance of the year, relative to opponent. There were purportedly some lucky bounces, but even if you take those out you’d be looking at giving up 80 pts on 50% shooting to an average Pac-12 offense. It sounds like we couldn’t stop Cunningham from getting in the lane, and didn’t close out shooters, especially Starks. This team has to play D to win, and this is a discouraging point in the season to get a poor effort.

The good: I’ve got 4 conference losses as my best realistic scenario, and we can fade one here. (I’m also looking at one at UW, one of two versus furd, and one either hosting Zona or on the LA trip.) Also, Zach Kline has a freakin’ gun, and a lightning release.

by Reef on Jan 5, 2012 9:13 PM PST reply actions  

@Colorado might be tough

"i, for one, welcome our new atomic overlords" - GoldBlooded

by atomsareenough on Jan 5, 2012 9:37 PM PST up reply actions  

Well, 14-4 is my best case. Worst case is about 11-7, and somewhere in that range are other possible losses in games we should win. Including this weekend, which is why I’m going to be sweating that one, bigtime.

by Reef on Jan 5, 2012 9:40 PM PST up reply actions  

On the bright side

Everyone else seems to have trouble winning on the road. If we hold serve at home, we should still be ok winning this conference.

BUT. If we want to get to the tourney for sure, we can probably afford maybe three more of these losses at the most, then at least win one or two conference tourney games. No margin for error really.

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 5, 2012 9:14 PM PST reply actions  

*we should still be on track to be the favorites to win the conference

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 5, 2012 9:14 PM PST up reply actions  

not really.

Nobody is going to win.
Just like Faraudo predicted.

by concordtom on Jan 5, 2012 9:23 PM PST up reply actions  

To be honest

I have only one hope for this season.
And that’s that Gutierrez wins POY honors.

We won Pac10 a couple years ago, so that is checked off.
Would like to win the Pac12 tourney, but, eh….

If Gut wins POY, wow – what a beautiful thing that would be. Just keep scoring, Gut!! Climb up in the top few in scoring, finish ahead of UW and OSU in the standings and it could be yours!

by concordtom on Jan 5, 2012 9:27 PM PST up reply actions  

we should really be worried about brandon smith

no bear, no care

by EchoOfSilence on Jan 5, 2012 9:15 PM PST reply actions  

Possible concussion or because he seems to have lost his confidence as a ball-handler and shooter?

Old Toothwrangler

by Kodiak on Jan 5, 2012 9:19 PM PST up reply actions  

Also, of all the losses, ours is the least inexplicable.

Furd losing to Oregon was probably similar to ours, and they lost worse.
Arizona playing like crap against UCLA.
UW vs. Colorado was shockingly bad.
WSU vs. Utah. Wow.

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 5, 2012 9:18 PM PST reply actions  

So, who won all those?

by concordtom on Jan 5, 2012 9:20 PM PST up reply actions  

The underdog in each one.

The #1 greatest threat to America: BEARS

by norcalnick on Jan 5, 2012 9:21 PM PST up reply actions  

UW lost?
WSU lost?
Ariz losing?
Furd lost?

by concordtom on Jan 5, 2012 9:21 PM PST up reply actions  

We’re supposed to be the most consistent, at least in my mind. So us not showing up defensively is harder to explain than other teams throwing up who are supposed to throw up occasionally.

Our edge is being there every night, giving the same effort, executing like the best-coached team in the league. We give up something when that doesn’t happen.

That said, you’re right, the conference is ours if we get our shit together.

by Reef on Jan 5, 2012 9:23 PM PST up reply actions  

Well, Oregon State had to win this if they want to win the conference. And they have the talent to go at us.

And based on that radiocast, they made a LOT of tough shots.

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 5, 2012 9:24 PM PST up reply actions  

Like I said above, I agree that it’s not a horribly surprising loss, and one that does’t hurt a ton in the bigger picture if we play well on Saturday. But I’m not a fan of how we lost. Like I also said above, I’m skeptical when I hear a team “lucked” their way into 92 points.

by Reef on Jan 5, 2012 9:29 PM PST up reply actions  

I would say that we played a mediocre defensive game compounded by the fact that Oregon State hit a lot of shots they’d usually miss.

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 5, 2012 9:32 PM PST up reply actions  

Agreed. And the D has to be good every single night, at least against the top half of the conference. We’re not a team that’s going to overwhelm you with talent and athleticism. We’ve got to play basketball better.

Play mediocre D against a decent team with its back against the wall, and this is what happens.

by Reef on Jan 5, 2012 9:35 PM PST up reply actions  

Get the split at home and we can live with this loss. Will be really interesting how Jared plays coming back home to Berk.

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 5, 2012 9:36 PM PST up reply actions  

Cunningham may or may not go off, but I feel very good that we will beat this team at Haas. Rather easily.

by Reef on Jan 5, 2012 9:38 PM PST up reply actions  

But don’t we also consistently lose to Oregon State?

by mrjpark on Jan 6, 2012 12:25 AM PST up reply actions  

Consistency of execution — much more important than the result of any particular game. It’s not that we lost, it’s how.

by Reef on Jan 6, 2012 12:05 PM PST up reply actions  

Post Game with Monty:

They knew it was Cunningham and Starks, but they both went for 24.

by concordtom on Jan 5, 2012 9:33 PM PST reply actions  

This was a night when almost all of the favorites lost. Like was said before, if we beat Oregon, it’ll be a meh weekend.

Lawrence Ross

by alpha1906 on Jan 5, 2012 9:40 PM PST reply actions  

Btw

Oregon State has been averaging 85 points per game at home before this one (and yes, they play some crap teams, but they do put up points). So this is par for the course.

by Avinash Kunnath on Jan 5, 2012 9:55 PM PST reply actions  

We’re supposed to be among the best defensive teams they see all year, not slightly worse than average.

by Reef on Jan 6, 2012 12:07 PM PST up reply actions  

Throw away game!

OSU is much better this year, and Cal always has trouble w/ them regardless every year… everyone else lost too, so that’s a plus.

However, i really like the chances of getting them back at Haas. Yes, they dropped 92(!!!) on us, but they also allowed 85(!!!!) points while allegedly mugging (according to Roxy) every Cal player w/o calls… Also, they needed to shoot 61% (11-18) from 3, and 63% from the field, twhich is everything and more you can ask for from an offense, to squeak out a 2 possession win. Highly unlikely they can repeat the effort on the road, at Haas.

Chin up, the Pac is weak this year so a team can lose 5 or 6 games and still win the the conference by a couple games. Still like our chances to take it for the second time in three years.

by stevvy89 on Jan 5, 2012 11:21 PM PST reply actions  

gah, can't do math... they won in a 3 possession game...

best not to drink and comment… probably explains the lack of DOOOOOOOOOOOM feeling right now too.

by stevvy89 on Jan 5, 2012 11:24 PM PST up reply actions  

Didn’t see, wtf happened?

by Missing Barry on Jan 5, 2012 11:40 PM PST reply actions  

The good news is...

that the other “contender” teams in conference lost (Washington, Arizona, and Furd). I would have really loved a win here to give us some breathing room, but yeah, we lost. OSU might end up making a run for the championship under Cunningham.

by Glanko on Jan 6, 2012 9:19 AM PST reply actions  

Jobbed by the refs?

You guys only had one more foul than us, plus you got a way with a few travels.

Follow me on Twitter! https://twitter.com/#!/ConnorPelton128

by ConnorOSU on Jan 6, 2012 4:42 PM PST reply actions  

Who knows, we weren’t actually able to watch the game, but it sounded on the radio like our guys were getting mugged and pummeled on several plays without a call, whereas any time Cunningham got brushed he got the call. But again, we couldn’t actually see the game, so who knows.

"i, for one, welcome our new atomic overlords" - GoldBlooded

by atomsareenough on Jan 6, 2012 5:18 PM PST up reply actions  

Our announcer painted a bit of a different picture

understandably… I guess that’s the nature of radio

by scotty256 on Jan 6, 2012 6:25 PM PST up reply actions  

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