Nate Longshore Doing a Peyton Manning?
So last week against ASU I saw something which caught my eye. In the past 4 years or so that I've really started to study and analyze the Cal offense I saw the QB do something I've never seen them do before. I saw a Cal QB create-a-play at the line of scrimmage.
You see, I've said many times before, Cal QBs cannot do their best Peyton Manning impressions (meaning they call any play they want at the LOS or create-a-play at the LOS). QBs in the Cal offense are allowed to change the direction of runs, allowed to choose between the run or pass play on option plays (where the offense goes to the LOS with two plays in mind), and is allowed to audible to pre-selected plays which are packaged jointly with the personnel and formation on the field.
But on Saturday against ASU, I am pretty sure we witnessed Longshore doing a Peyton Manning-esque create-a-play at the LOS.
Let's have a look.

Above is the pre-snap look. Cal has 11 personnel on the field (3 WRs, 1 TE, 1 RB). Longshore is in shotgun with twin WRs to the open side of the field along with the TE ("open side" = the side of the offense with more field).
[Author addition post-publishing:
dballisloose asked a very good question in the comments:
Why do you always start off by saying “Cal has 11 personnel on the field”? How many did you expect them to have? I say, if there are 10 or 12, go ahead and mention it ;-)
I’m sorry, I guess I haven’t explained this before, but when I say “11 personnel” I don’t mean 11 people on the field.
Personnel packages are given numbers which correspond to how many RBs, TEs, or WRs, are on the field.
The first digit corresponds to how many RBs are on the field. The second digit corresponds to how many TEs are on the field. The number of WRs is implied. Thus 11 personnel = 1 RB (first digit), 1 TE (second digit), (3 WRs implied). 12 personnel = 1 RB, 2 TEs, (2 WRs implied). And so on…
When Cal is on defense, you can see the coaching assistant on the east sideline put up a yellow card with such numbers alerting the defensive players on the field of the offensive substitutions and what offensive personnel package the offense has on the field.]


But Longshore sees something in the defense. Longshore looks to his left and gives a signal to the SE WR (split end wide receiver). I've shown Longshore looking at the WR with the green vision cone.

Longshore then looks to his right and gives another signal to the twin FL (flanker) WRs to the offense's right. I've shown Longshore looking right and signaling with the green vision cone.

Above is the pre-snap look just before the snap. I've shown the routes of the SE WR and the RB with blue lines. The SE WR runs a quick in, and the RB runs a replace route [edit: correct name for the RB route is a "replace" route and not an outside sluggo].
I believe that Longshore was attempting to set up a "pick" on the ASU WLB (weakside linebacker). Longshore saw that the ASU WLB was in man coverage against the RB, Vereen. Vereen against a LB is a mis-match, a mis-match that Longshore was trying to exploit with the help of a WR pick.
Unfortunately, the pick does not work because the ASU WLB got a running start on the play prior to the snap. I've shown the ASU WLB getting his running start with the desert red arrow.
The two Cal FL WRs off the bottom of the screen are running comebacks.

Because the ASU WLB got a running start on the play, he got into the backfield quickly and jammed Vereen in the backfield. Furthermore, the ASU WLB avoided the SE WR's quick in which could have set the pick. Longshore was probably not anticipating the ASU WLB to get the running start and thought the ASU WLB would be in his normal 4-3 position.

Longshore gives one last look to his left to see if Vereen could beat the jam and the ASU WLB. I've circled Vereen and the ASU WLB. Note the SE WR just off the screen. Had the ASU WLB been where Longshore thought the LB would normally be, the WLB probably would have been picked by the SE WR and Vereen would be wide open down the sidelines.

But Vereen wasn't open so Longshore scrambles to his right, going through his progressions, and looking to his other options. Longshore even directs traffic by pointing to where he wants his FL WRs to go.

Longshore passes the ball...

And it's caught by Boateng.
Final Thoughts:
So how am I pretty sure that this was a create-a-play rather than an option play, or a pre-selected package play?
Well, it wasn't an option play because if it was, then Longshore would have only given one signal to the entire offense. It also wasn't a pre-selected package play because, like an option play, Longshore would have given one signal to the entire offense. On this particular play, Longshore gave out two distinctly different signals.
I've never seen any Cal QB do what Longshore did. I wasn't following the 2004 Cal offense as closely as I do now so I can't really say if Rodgers did this or not, but I'm pretty sure he never did. In my opinion, aside from Rodgers, no other Cal QB has been so "on the same page" as Tedford than Longshore. So it really doesn't come as any surprise to me that the first Cal QB to completely make his own play at the LOS would be Longshore.
So what are we to make of the fact that Longshore did a create-a-play Peyton Manning like-impression at the LOS?
It must mean that he's been given the approval by Tedford and Cignetti. And if he's been given the approval to do so, he must have the requisite knowledge of the offense and defenses - or even more than the requisite knowledge. Longshore might have the "expert" level of knowledge. It shouldn't be surprising that Longshore has such a high level of knowledge considering he is in his 5th year, and has about 24 games worth of starter experience.
It will be interesting to see how much more of this we see in the future by Longshore and other Cal QBs.
Comments
Longshore went through progressions? Your analysis is flawed!!
From my basic observation during the game, it seemed that Longshore was more active with the offense before the snap than Riley.
by turkey on
Oct 13, 2008 1:19 PM PDT
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33Swisher is going to have something to say about these "alleged" progressions . . .
"You can have the alimony. But I want some pussy payments!" - Chris Rock
by oaktownmario on
Oct 13, 2008 1:22 PM PDT
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I predict Olsonist and CalISeth might also chime in!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 1:25 PM PDT
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His Olsonist-ship was caught up in a gale off Pt Conception but he sincerely appreciates your interest. Winds peaked at 50 knots with waves at about 18 feet. Miserable fun. In SB, I got invited for a ride on Taxi Dancer, a Reichel-Pugh 70 sled. Sweet. Friday, I’m heading off to Tucson for a visit with the cousins. I’ll try to post pictures of his Lardship’s butt.
A fifth year senior should be able to create a play at the LOS. Still, might a QB give two signals, one real and one fake? I don’t know but it’s a thought.
I think that Hydro photoshopped the play and that it didn’t break down like he’s saying. Boateng holding onto a pass? How gullible does Hydro think we are?
Stanfurd Delendum Est.
by Olsonist on
Oct 15, 2008 7:56 PM PDT
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I feel as if several times, Longshore told a player to go to another place. Either he was doing some sort of audible or the players were lining up incorrectly. If Tedford wasn’t going to play Slocum, meaning the entirety of the running was on Vereen and he didn’t want to tire out Vereen (which unfortunately DID happen), then we were going to throw a lot. Clearly, Tedford trusts Longshore to run the offense more than Riley and I think Tedford was proven correct there.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:43 PM PDT
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11 personnel on the field?
Why do you always start off by saying “Cal has 11 personnel on the field”? How many did you expect them to have? I say, if there are 10 or 12, go ahead and mention it ;-)
Overall, this is a pretty good analysis, and I like the frame-by-frame screenshots, they really help make your point and help us follow your thinking. Good post.
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 1:20 PM PDT
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Hydro does that for stupid people amongst us. Like me!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 1:20 PM PDT
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"stupid people amongst us" and "like me"
Redundant.
"You can have the alimony. But I want some pussy payments!" - Chris Rock
by oaktownmario on
Oct 13, 2008 1:24 PM PDT
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Touche, salesman.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 1:26 PM PDT
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I’m sorry, I guess I haven’t explained this before, but when I say “11 personnel” I don’t mean 11 people on the field.
Personnel packages are given numbers which correspond to how many RBs, TEs, or WRs, are on the field.
The first digit corresponds to how many RBs are on the field. The second digit corresponds to how many TEs are on the field. The number of WRs is implied. Thus 11 personnel = 1 RB (first digit), 1 TE (second digit), (3 WRs implied). 12 personnel = 1 RB, 2 TEs, (2 WRs implied). And so on…
When Cal is on defense, you can see the coaching assistant put up a yellow card with such numbers alerting the defensive players on the field of the offensive substitutions.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 1:36 PM PDT
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Interesting, we learn something new every day……except for Twisty, because he learns old things every day, and never learns anything that the rest of us consider new, because it took him so long to catch up that we’ve already moved on. Are you following?
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 1:50 PM PDT
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………….No…………
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 1:58 PM PDT
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lemme explain....
do you understand the words that are coming out of my mouth?
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:05 PM PDT
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…………….maybe.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 2:09 PM PDT
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Bueno, a veces no entiendes lo que estamos ensenandote, pues esta bien porque puedo hablarte con mis dedos lo mismo que hablo a nate longshore…..asi, mira nate, tu eres numero uno mijito…….carajo.
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:14 PM PDT
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yo quiero taco bell
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:21 PM PDT
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yes
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:39 PM PDT
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blahblahblahblahblahblahIwantTedfordsBabiesblahblah
It's spelled "S-h-u-f-a-i-l"
by JShufelt on
Oct 13, 2008 2:28 PM PDT
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Tedford’s babies aren’t nearly as desireable as SydGod’s babies. The real question is, would SydGod’s babies be born with a gold grill?
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:29 PM PDT
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I don’t speak blahblah as well as Twist, but I’m hoping that I translated it correctly so he could understand it.
It's spelled "S-h-u-f-a-i-l"
by JShufelt on
Oct 13, 2008 2:32 PM PDT
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Unfortunately, I got a 2 on AP blahblah. I’m not the one to ask on this.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 2:38 PM PDT
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Good Stuff
Glad you explained that HydroTech. Love the analysis and the various pictures. Love this kind of stuff. the 11 personnel thing was new to me. Good stuff keep it up
get off me bandwagoners!
http://blog.cleancutmedia.com
by cleancutmedia on
Oct 14, 2008 9:55 AM PDT
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Longshore and Manning used in the same sentence?
The reason we haven’t heard a response from Olsonist yet is because his brain just exploded.
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 1:27 PM PDT
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Clearly, Longshore is the 4th Manning brother!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 1:35 PM PDT
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I don’t really follow pro ball but I’ve really liked the Mannings.
Stanfurd Delendum Est.
by Olsonist on
Oct 15, 2008 8:06 PM PDT
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Signals
So, Longshore turns to one side of the field, and calls out a different play, telling the WR to set a pick for the RB. Then, he turns to the other side of the field, and tells the other WRs….?
What does he tell them? Does he give them new routes as well? Does he simply tell them that he changed the routes on the other side of the ball? Would routes on opposite sides of the field typically be coordinated so that every wideout would need to know what the other receivers are doing?
So, basically, you gotta Go Bears!
by ragnarok on
Oct 13, 2008 1:30 PM PDT
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Longshore turns left and tells the SE WR to run a quick in. Longshore turns right and tells the twin FL WRs to run comebacks. That’s it.
Longshore does not tell the twin FL WRs he changed the route on the other side of the field because they know it because they saw (and heard) it. All the WRs presumably know what each other is running because they can see (and hear) the hand signals.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 1:33 PM PDT
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I give Longshore signals
I sign in to him “1”, and sometimes I also tell him that he should run the “11” package….which I sign with one digit from each hand.
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 1:51 PM PDT
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Isn't Vereen's route just a go?
Or maybe a stop and go? I thought a sluggo would involve him slanting towards the middle of the field before turning upfield.
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 1:42 PM PDT
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You could be right. The names of RB routes are different than WR routes. I was merely applying the WR route name to the RB route since I am not privy to the names of the RB routes. This website calls Vereen’s route a “replace” route – although Cal assuredly uses a different name for it.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 1:46 PM PDT
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Sluggo is also a type of fishing lure that mimics a wounded baitfish. Just thought I’d add to the football analysis around here…
by sec119 on
Oct 13, 2008 2:23 PM PDT
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I once caught two bass on the same Rapala…it was pretty cool. Definitely upped my fish:cast ratio.
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 2:37 PM PDT
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That’s some serious talent, would have been even more impressive if that Rapala only had one treble hook
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:40 PM PDT
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not that many people would know what i’m talking about but i once was reeling in a rockfish that i had caught on a single hook jig, and had a lingcod come up from below, bite the rockfish, and hang on to the rockfish long enough for me to gaff it. so i guess technically that was two fish on a single hook!
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:43 PM PDT
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Wow, I thought that kind of stuff only happened in cartoons.
by sec119 on
Oct 13, 2008 2:44 PM PDT
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If you’ve ever seen a lingcod, you’d understand…..they are close to the top of their food chain, 30% of their body is their mouth with pointy front teeth. almost had to bust out my holy hand grenade.
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:48 PM PDT
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I’ve seen a lingcod. I understand. Gaffs are for pussies.
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 3:28 PM PDT
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Yes, well I have a gaff I use for pussies too.
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 5:13 PM PDT
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Anyone need a ticket for the UCLA game?
I have an extra ticket for the Cal-UCLA game, I’ll be posting it up on Craigslist but thought I’d be inappropriate and mention it here
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:07 PM PDT
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im looking for a ticket
hey dballisloose. i hope its not on craigslist yet.
send me an email- mellowfellow [at] gmail.com
thanks.
by mellowfellow on
Oct 14, 2008 1:12 PM PDT
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This is an interesting analysis, and much appreciated since I don’t pick up on things like these. Thanks. Could we say, fairly, that Longshore has reached that state of football nirvana, where he is one with Tedford? Maybe he’ll be a great coach one day.
by sec119 on
Oct 13, 2008 2:25 PM PDT
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You're not subtle enough - I can tell you're just a Longshore-lover
Yes, Nate called a butt-load of audibles in that game. No, the results weren’t very impressive.
He does have a lot of experience and knowledge. The ASU game was a good example of why that’s not enough. We need offense, and we need it when we’re in trouble, and in the 4th quarter, and we need to play with passion, and we need to make plays. Riley’s better at those (fallible though he is).
I will NOT enjoy telling you “I told you so” the next time Nate loses us a game in the 4th quarter. Maybe Tedford will have the smarts to know when to pull him…but it doesn’t look likely.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 13, 2008 2:26 PM PDT
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Who would genuinely enjoy saying “I told you that Cal would lose”?
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 2:31 PM PDT
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Maybe Tedford is already running a two-QB system and you just don’t know it because we never trailed at the ASU game.
by Rishi on
Oct 13, 2008 2:34 PM PDT
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I don’t want Longshore thinking independently
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 2:37 PM PDT
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Why imply editorializing when none is there?
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 2:38 PM PDT
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Because it starts a good argument.
When I say friendly boring things, no one replies to my comments.
Well, that’s conjecture – I don’t ever just say friendly boring things.
Let’s try it: nice weather we’re having today. Gosh, I think we’re all Bear fans.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 15, 2008 4:00 PM PDT
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ASU game isn’t that good an example, since Longshore did enough to win and made no egregious mistakes in the 4th quarter.
by sec119 on
Oct 13, 2008 2:45 PM PDT
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What exactly do you mean by playing with ‘passion’? I’m willing to listen to a variety of Longshore vs. Riley arguments either way, but random guessing at their emotional levels during the game and the impact is has isn’t going to be convincing anyone.
Also…Nate didn’t lose this game in the 4th quarter…
by norcalnick on
Oct 13, 2008 2:56 PM PDT
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Instead of Nate Longshore’s mechanical interceptions, he wants Kevin Riley’s passionate interceptions.
by BearsNecessity on
Oct 13, 2008 3:00 PM PDT
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Correction: Kevin Riley’s passionate interception.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:02 PM PDT
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I’m still waiting for an emaculate interception
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 3:04 PM PDT
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As compared to the immaculate?
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:24 PM PDT
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Oh Twisty don’t get all spell-checky on me….as compared to the ejaculate interceptions you might be more familiar with
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 3:26 PM PDT
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The only one I’m familiar with is Ashwaryi Rai!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:30 PM PDT
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I want premature interceptions.
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 4:05 PM PDT
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Aren’t they all?
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 5:14 PM PDT
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No. For reasons only Twist understands.
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 5:31 PM PDT
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Hey now, watch what you say about Aishwarya Rai!
by Rishi on
Oct 14, 2008 8:47 AM PDT
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If Twisted and Rai mated the result would be a virgin birth.
Stanfurd Delendum Est.
by Olsonist on
Oct 15, 2008 8:13 PM PDT
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California Golden Blogs: Interceptions with Passion.
…if ever there was a Bollywood movie blog about Cal football, I’m pretty sure that’s what it would be called.
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 3:18 PM PDT
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As long as it stars Ashwaryi Rai, I don’t care what it’s called!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:25 PM PDT
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she’s an ejaculate interception fo’ sho’
I left my heart at the Durant Food Court
by dballisloose on
Oct 13, 2008 3:26 PM PDT
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I know Passion when I see it
It’s like obscenity. So I can’t spell it out for you. But I think you know what I mean anyways. Nate doesn’t seem fired up enough to me. In a big, catch-all, general kind of way, over the years and including this year.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 15, 2008 4:02 PM PDT
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Perhaps Longshore doesn’t show physical, visible, or obvious signs of “passion” (whatever that may be), but Longshore certainly wants to win just as much as Riley – make no mistake about that.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 15, 2008 4:04 PM PDT
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I made a mistake about it once. What a mistake!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 15, 2008 4:19 PM PDT
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Okay
I’m not sure if you’re being sarcastic or not.
Let me reiterate for the 293984th time, just in case you aren’t being sarcastic, that I really don’t care who is the Cal QB. I just want wins. I do admit I spent a lot of time defending Longshore last year, but I was defending him from a lot of misguided and misplaced anger. What happened last year was somewhat Longshore’s fault, but also not entirely his fault – yet people were more than willing to just place 100% of the blame on Longshore.
The purpose of this post isn’t to secretly pump up Longshore over Riley. The purpose of this post was to point out something which I noticed. I cannot help it if the first QB I see creating his own play at the LOS is Longshore. I did not email Tedford and ask him to let Longshore be the first QB to do that so I can make a post about it to secretly endorse Longshore.
As for the whole 4th quarter INT thing… that argument is riddled with flaws that I have debunked many times on our prior site. I need not go into the argument again but will merely say that people who believe that for some reason Longshore becomes epically worse in a matter of a minute when the 3rd quarter ends and the 4th quarter starts, need to really look elsewhere for reasons why Longshore’s INT rate went up in the 4th qtr (closer games, must-pass situations, QB/WR miscommuncations… etc.).
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 3:03 PM PDT
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Admit it Hydro, you're a Longshorite and you will be to the grave.
My guess is JerrottWillard is from BI and doesn’t yet know how things work around here…
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 3:19 PM PDT
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As CGB’s preeminent Longshore-basher bar none (get in line Seth, get way back in line) I can attest to Hydro’s wanting wins regardless of QB unlike that high priest of the Jews for Longshore sect, Twisted, who can’t be trusted.
It was a good analysis.
That said I don’t agree with Hydro’s explanations of Longshore’s evident affection of the 4th quarter INT. I’d also say that his Lardship’s propensity towards the 4th quarter INT factored into Cignetti’s ultra-conservative play calling in the 4th quarter of the ASU game.
Stanfurd Delendum Est.
by Olsonist on
Oct 15, 2008 8:32 PM PDT
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So a win isn't enough?
You’re one of those who want a BLOWOUT every time Cal plays, eh?
And if they don’t have a blowout, it’s a sure sign that the offense is flailing and we’ll lose our next game.
lolk
by Swamphunter on
Oct 13, 2008 3:29 PM PDT
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Is the k separate from the lol, there? Or is it part of the acronym? Does it stand for laughing out loud kid? Or is it laughing out loud, abbreviated OK? Because then, you’d need lol,k. Without the comma, it’s confusing.
To say the least. And I often say the least.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:31 PM PDT
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It's the second one.
But if it’s that confusing, I’ll add a comma just for you from now on. :-)
by Swamphunter on
Oct 13, 2008 3:35 PM PDT
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Twist brain hurt!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:35 PM PDT
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:-(
It’s okay Twist. I know that you have a hard time understanding all of this newfangled Internet lingo, so I’ll keep it simple from now on.
by Swamphunter on
Oct 13, 2008 3:41 PM PDT
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Ok, I’m going to need bullet points on this one.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:43 PM PDT
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Um - who doesn't ever want Cal to win in a blow-out?
Sure, I love it when we have a blow-out. That Wazzu win was enjoyable – we don’t get that many touchdowns very often, so I enjoyed it.
It sure is more exciting when we are the double-digit underdogs, and we come from behind, or overcome adversity, etc., I feel that way, too.
You’re mistaking my criticism of our weak offense (and if you were at the game, the offense was weak – it just was), for a bad thing.
It’s a good thing to be like that. It mentally prepares the Bear Fan for what’s to come. It makes the Bear Fan appreciate good offense, and not be fooled into thinking his team is #1 in the country when it’s not, and then being disappointed when they don’t run the table (“who could’ve known?”).
The best thing in the world is for Cal to exceed my expectations.
And you know, there are the expectations it’s safe to say out loud, and the other expectations you keep a secret.
Make no mistake – I’ll take any Pac-10 win I can get, anytime. Be it through injuries, bad calls, or an earthquake opening up to swallow a Stanford kick-returner as time expires in the Big Game before he can score the winning touchdown (does anyone else have that as a recurring dream?).
I just don’t want any of you to go around swaggering about how much ass our offense is kicking this year when it hasn’t done that much. I want the team to be working very hard to get better, not resting on any assumptions about we could achieve against any other Pac-10 defenses.
I’m not unreasonable – I think one of my most satisfied days was when we beat Oregon at home in ‘06. They were a very good team, and we beat them, straight up. We had good offense that day, and Longshore was the quarterback – he did a good job. It’s not like I can’t appreciate when it’s good.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 15, 2008 4:11 PM PDT
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I was at the ASU game. Our offense was pretty good in the first half, weak in the third quarter, and non-existent in the 4th. The decrease in productivity wasn’t necessarily Longshore’s fault, either, as he rarely got opportunities in the 4th. To be fair, what opportunities he did get, he didn’t succeed.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 15, 2008 4:21 PM PDT
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This post might almost be on topic – I think there was some odd play calling in the 3rd/4th that made it harder on Nate to shine. I seem to recall one O series with 3 or 4 runs in a row, and the next one had 3 or 4 pass plays in a row. I remember commenting to the other people with me at the game on that.
But I just thought we should have seen Riley at some point. Don’t you think it’s bad for his state of mind not be given a single series to show what he’s got? Oops, I’m back to Riley v. Nate again. I’m telling you, I just have 3 years of pent-up issues about this, and I have to get it out on this thread – appropriateness be damned!
So on that note – this “we need to start faster” business doesn’t ring true to me.
I mean, yes, we NEED to start faster. But someone look up the stats for me – because I don’t think Nate is good at starting faster. I think our first drive stats are pretty bad with Nate.
So he’s using that as an excuse to play Nate, is all I’m saying. I think he’s determined to get Nate an NFL career. You gotta admire the loyalty, but I think it cost us some games.
Maybe JT is thinking WAY WAY long term, dudes. It’s good for quarterback recruiting when he keeps giving Nate a chance. All those blue chips worried about having a bad game and being yanked (happens all over the country) will be looking harder at Cal.
Oh, that Jeff, he’s so smart.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 15, 2008 4:43 PM PDT
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Actually, Longshore’s first drive stats were very good once you throw out the two balls that he threw away due to pressure.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 15, 2008 5:34 PM PDT
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Longshore had 9 passes on the first drive. One throw-away pass was due to nobody being open. A second throw away pass was due to very quick QB pressure. There was the incomplete fade pass in the corner of the endzone which was a decent ball and catchable (but it wasn’t caught), and there was the overthrow/ball-slips-out-of-hand on the 3rd and Goal (where Longshore also didn’t see the open TE in the endzone). Basically, I can only really say Longshore had one bad pass on the opening drive – and that was the 3rd and goal throw which should have gone to TE Smith.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 15, 2008 5:43 PM PDT
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Yes, ASU 1Q stats were pretty good. I mean long term.
You’ve probably done it in the past – what are the multi-game stats under Nate on his first drive?
I admit, all I have is a recollection of us always receiving the kick-off when we win the toss (bad move! bad move!), and then often not scoring. Is that right? Did we fail to score on more than 50% of our opening drives under Nate? (and yes, I admit that doesn’t mean it’s all nate’s fault. If the running back fumbles to kill the drive – it’s not Nate’s fault. But the point JT is making is changing QBs will make a difference – he didn’t change he rest of the O starters)
If I’m wrong, I’ll admit it, but I think that’s true – we failed to score on most of our opening drives under Nate.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 16, 2008 9:44 AM PDT
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I do not our first drive stats collated. It would be interesting to see. A more interesting comparison would be comparing Longshore’s 1st drive efficiency versus Riley’s first drive efficiency. That’s what we’re really getting at here, right? Of course, one might argue that Riley has too small a sample size to really get an accurate gauge on his abilities.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 16, 2008 10:40 AM PDT
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Maybe JT is thinking WAY WAY long term, dudes. It’s good for quarterback recruiting when he keeps giving Nate a chance. All those blue chips worried about having a bad game and being yanked (happens all over the country) will be looking harder at Cal.
Oh, I hate this argument. The counter-argument is that QBs will stay away because a deserving understudy never gets time. Tedford has shown way too much loyalty to Longshore for even Longshore’s own good, let alone Cal’s. There is no defense to not giving Riley a single play last year from the OSU game all the way to the second quarter of the AF Bowl. None. That’s not even loyalty. That’s a man crush.
Stanfurd Delendum Est.
by Olsonist on
Oct 15, 2008 8:38 PM PDT
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Yeah, that's what I'm sayin...
Thanks for removing whatever sugar-coating I’d been putting on it.
It was probably fake Saccharin-based sugar that was giving you cancer anyways, so we’re well rid of it.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 16, 2008 9:45 AM PDT
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interesting example
I’m pretty sure that longshore has done that sort of thing more often. sometimes it seems he only signals to one side of the field, or only tells the line/rb’s what the changes are. Likely a good portion is as you say, from one pre-planned activity to another.
He was doing what the qb in the full ‘west coast’ offense is supposed to do. read the defense, and try to get the ball to your best player who has an advantage on the defense. sometimes that means changing the play, to something pre-planned, sometimes changing to something less planned.
I think this is why Tedford likes longshore over riley right now, riley is quite there with the read/changes.
all of you conspiracy nuts, get a grip we are 4-1. even a complete collapse won’t be the worst year in recent memory by a longshot.
Go Bears Go
by Rocksanddirt on
Oct 13, 2008 3:00 PM PDT
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What happened to Morrah on this play?
Unless I lost count of one of the safeties, Morrah was matched up 1v1 against the Sam ‘backer, without any safety help, as the strongside safety was in man coverage on the slot receiver. That’s a matchup I’d take on just about any play. Did Morrah not get open, or did Nate just miss him?
For whatever reason, the ASU linebackers quickly diagnosed that Vereen was the intended target. Not only did the Will get ahead of the would-be screen, but the Mike very aggressively pursued to that side of the field as well. On the one hand, you have to question Nate’s adjustments for not yielding the hoped-for result, and damn near running the play clock to :00 in the process. On the other, to his credit, Nate actually showed off some mobility (!), bought some time, and made a nice throw for the first down.
I’d love to hear how the coaches graded this play and whether or not we’ll see more of the same in the weeks ahead. It’s at least a good sign that the coaches’ confidence level is growing not just in Longshore but in the receivers as well.
Go Bears!
by California Pete on
Oct 13, 2008 3:04 PM PDT
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“For whatever reason, the ASU linebackers quickly diagnosed that Vereen was the intended target.”
There might be because he seemed to touch the ball on 75% of the plays up until that point. (I’m sure that’s not the exact number, but he did get a lot of touches) If you’re a defensive player in the right spot to gamble on Vereen, take the chance. Same goes when Best is in.
by turkey on
Oct 13, 2008 3:08 PM PDT
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yes
until we show otherwise, the right defense is to key on the rb’s both running and pass catching.
Go Bears Go
by Rocksanddirt on
Oct 13, 2008 3:09 PM PDT
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likely he couldn't see him well enough
when rolling back across the field to find morrah, who was likely as open as boteng.
Go Bears Go
by Rocksanddirt on
Oct 13, 2008 3:08 PM PDT
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I’m not sure what happened to Morrah. He is completely off the screen.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 3:09 PM PDT
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You know, nobody has considered the alternative to the “Longshore is one with Tedford” narrative here.
Maybe Longshore totes just took over, made his own call, and then got chewed out on the sideline. Sure, due to luck and happenstance this abortion of a play that Longshore dreamed up managed to somehow, inexplicably work out. But like that’ll ever happen again after Tedford went OFF on Longshore on the sidelines.
How do we know that didn’t happen?
Hydro is JUST trying to promote more of his Longshoreaganda here. Trying to help keep the Prileytariat down!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:11 PM PDT
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another interesting analysis.
though I think that would have been observed, based on how closely folks have rewatched the game.
Go Bears Go
by Rocksanddirt on
Oct 13, 2008 3:30 PM PDT
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You know, nobody has considered the alternative to the “We would have noticed that” narrative here.
Maybe HydroTech has brainwashed you all with Longshoreaganda into FORGETTING how much Tedford yelled at Longshore.
How do we know that didn’t happen?
Hydro is JUST trying to promote more of his Longshoreaganda here. Trying to help keep the Prileyatariat down!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:32 PM PDT
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The truth must be told
Hydro IS Longshore. Longshore IS Hydro. Think about it: Have you seen Longshore post to his blog since this mysterious “HydroTech” person started posting here? No.
Done and done.
by CalBandGreat on
Oct 13, 2008 3:36 PM PDT
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How ironic. HydroShore was caught by the very person trying to catch him (slash them).
Anyway, does this mean that Olsonist is Kevin Riley?
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:37 PM PDT
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You got me. I’m Nate Longshore. That’s why I never live-blog home games – because I’m at the games. As for away games, I secretly live-blog the away games from my helmet. Stop exposing me.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 3:53 PM PDT
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I guess you could say I “interception” your identity.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA I’M SO FUNNY!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:55 PM PDT
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I also can’t spell. DAMN YOU, INABILITY TO THINK STRAIGHT!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:56 PM PDT
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…blog complete with Bollywood translations too!
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:01 PM PDT
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Hey! I figured it out. You’re interferon with my fun!
by CalBandGreat on
Oct 13, 2008 3:58 PM PDT
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Shhhh...
Don’t tell anyone, but Hydro is using mental telepathy to live-blog while playing in the games (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27162401/)
by SonofCalifornia on
Oct 13, 2008 5:05 PM PDT
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claiming you aren't a longshore apologist is just silly
First you say you don’t care who the qb is, yet you compare him to peyton manning, perhaps the best qb in the nfl, and say this “As for the whole 4th quarter INT thing… that argument is riddled with flaws that I have debunked many times on our prior site.” The fact is the guy has repeatably choked in pressure situations and as much as you want to parrot tedford i.e. “the receiver ran the wrong route” bs the fact is riley and MANY other cal QBs under tedford haven’t turned the ball over as much as nate by a WIDE margin. Nate isn’t just REALLY unlucky. MSU proved that beyond a reasonable doubt.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 3:41 PM PDT
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I would venture to say
That calling for Riley now after his playing like JaMarcus Russell would make you a Riley apologist. But who’s counting?
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 3:43 PM PDT
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wake me up when nate plays better than riley. or at least enough to justify benching him. nate missed many a wide open receiver against ASU, just like kevin did against maryland etc. Neither of them are going to get the Aaron Rodgers QB of the year award, but one of them doesn’t turn it over.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 3:45 PM PDT
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You’re right, Riley throws incompletions with passion.
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 3:47 PM PDT
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incompletions are better than INTs no?
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 3:49 PM PDT
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Above all, passion is the key. Passionless completions are unimportant compared to passionate interceptions.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:55 PM PDT
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Please show me when I mentioned passion in any of my posts?
The fact is that Nate this year hasn’t played up to 06 or even arguably 07 levels. Until he starts lighting it up, the “I told you nate is a great qb and all his problems were desean jackson and hawkins” arguments from the golden blogs are a little premature no?
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 3:58 PM PDT
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Right above when yo uwrote “wake me up when nate players with more passion than riley. or at least enough passion to justify benching him. passion. nate missed many a wide open and ultimately passionate receiver against asu. passion!”
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:59 PM PDT
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dude
he threw 3 TDs in the last game. calm that hatred down.
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 3:59 PM PDT
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last sat was one of the lowest offensive outputs in jeff tedford’s coaching career. I don’t hate nate. I like nate. I just don’t like people who turn him into something he isn’t.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:01 PM PDT
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I don't like people who like to overlook the fact that Riley played like crap this season too.
Hey, if Riley had played like he did in the Armed Forces Bowl, we’d have no controversy, and we’d still be polishing the frescoes in the Hall of Riley. He didn’t. Longshore got one start, and won the game. And you’re STILL complaining?
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 4:03 PM PDT
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And that’s why we have the party yacht!!!!
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 4:09 PM PDT
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I'm getting an early start on the Bridgford Shrine myself.
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 4:10 PM PDT
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Too soon!! Too soon!!
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 4:12 PM PDT
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You can start this week when he plays on FSNPT Mission Viejo vs. Tesoro
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 5:31 PM PDT
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You probably mean me, but I know he played like crap (sometimes)
He also played well, sometimes. I’m taking all his plays into account. I’m taking all of Longshore’s plays into account, too.
I’m complaining that he got the whole 4 quarters, not that we got the win.
I’ll grant Nate the start, begrudgingly. I think Riley earned the starter position, and didn’t do enough to lose it. He also did some good things to keep it.
And look, if Riley played bad enough, God forbid, I’d say put Nate back in. I just don’t see it that way now, and I’m really disappointed Riley didn’t get some playing time to prove himself.
Doesn’t it seem like Nate gets more chances to do good to atone for his mistakes, and Riley only got a few games to be perfect in, and was pulled?
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 15, 2008 4:20 PM PDT
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No, you’re right. It does seem like perhaps Riley is getting less chances this year than Longshore got last year. But as many other people have pointed out, that could be because Tedford is learning from his mistake last year (sticking with a less efficient QB for so long), and thus is being quicker to switch to a QB who is being more effective.
Yes, it does suck that perhaps Riley got shafted this year, and he’s not getting the same treatment this year as Longshore did last year, but just because Tedford made the mistake to Longshore’s benefit last year doesn’t mean Tedford has to make the same mistake this year to Riley’s benefit.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 15, 2008 4:30 PM PDT
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Damn, now you're using my own logic
I was hoping no one would mention that.
But do you think Nate’s ASU start qualified as a ‘fast start’? And keeps him the job?
And if we’re going to use logic, if Tedford is quick to react this year to bad QB play, how quickly should he forget Nate’s double INT against Michigan St.?
Thanks for your discussion, Hydro – I’d like to buy you a beer sometime.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 15, 2008 4:50 PM PDT
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I think Longshore’s ASU start was faster than what Riley had given the team in the prior 3 games. But Longshore’s start certainly wasn’t flawless. Overall, Longshore did decent but I don’t think he did well enough to lock down the starting job for sure.
As for Longshore’s double INTs against MSU, Tedford didn’t forgive Longshore for 3 straight games since Riley got the starting job hands down (after MSU until ASU). But I suppose since Riley has cooled off a bit, Tedford has forgiven Longshore for those 2 INTs and thus figured he was worth another shot.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 15, 2008 5:39 PM PDT
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Also, last year, we didnt have a backup of the level of Longshore.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 15, 2008 6:07 PM PDT
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That logic just eats itself. Last year we didn’t have a backup because Tedford wouldn’t play Riley unless forced to either by injury or by rebelling fans.
Stanfurd Delendum Est.
by Olsonist on
Oct 15, 2008 8:45 PM PDT
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I felt Tedford was getting a bit cocky last year when he said “Let Them Play Riley!”
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 15, 2008 9:32 PM PDT
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It is true that, unfortunately, given that we have a crop of talented, but young and inexperienced WRs with our backup RB, we didn’t have a great offensive day. We still put up 24 points through 3 quarters, before going into run out the clock mode.
Say that I’m trying to “boost” Longshore’s abilities or something . Fair enough. But we didn’t exactly have Hawkins and DeSean out there on Saturday.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:04 PM PDT
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If fancy charts mean more to you than win and losses and TDs and INTs I don’t know what to tell you.
lol
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:06 PM PDT
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You really really missed my reference when I said “Longshore doing a Peyton Manning?” You really really really missed the reference.
I am not saying Longshore is as great of a QB as Peyton Manning. I don’t think anybody has made that argument or is willing to make that argument.
In case you don’t know this about Peyton Manning, but he often changes the play at the LOS and is known to literally create his own plays at the LOS. That is what I was referencing when I said “Longshore doing a Peyton Manning?”
I hope this clears things up.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 3:45 PM PDT
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If he didn’t have a firm grasp on the use of English in your first post, I doubt it’ll get much firmer with the ensuing posts.
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 3:50 PM PDT
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maybe we just need to bring back Pain Train Week
Or is it officially Pain Train Year?
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 3:51 PM PDT
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right because pulling out the grammar card is always the way to win an argument in the internet.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 3:55 PM PDT
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HAHA
but actually understanding the argument and comparison presented is a good way.
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 3:57 PM PDT
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You're right, making baseless conclusions is.
Let us know when you can put together something as comprehensive as this for Riley. Until then, keep on drinking, buddy!
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 3:58 PM PDT
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If fancy charts mean more to you than win and losses and TDs and INTs I don’t know what to tell you.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:04 PM PDT
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Right, it isn’t like you were shitting on Nate for winning a game.
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:05 PM PDT
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you need to ask yourself why you searched the entire ASU game film to find something that nate does better than kevin riley. I suggest having a few drinks and thinking a bit about that.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 3:52 PM PDT
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Again, it’s not that he does it better than Riley. It’s that he did it at all! If he had done it worse than Riley, it still would have been important to note. It’s about a change in the normal Cal offensive philosophy. Normally, Cal coaches don’t trust the QBs enough to allow audibles. For some reason, they did for Longshore here. Does it mean that Tedford has a secret mancrush on Longshore and wants to murder Riley in his sleep?
Most assuredly, yes!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:58 PM PDT
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Can we pretty please start flagging people and making them feel unwelcome when they say silly things? PLEASE?
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:00 PM PDT
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How is it that I’m the nice guy in all this? I’m the asshole! Just ask The Maharg. He knows it better than anybody!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:01 PM PDT
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Maharg knows your asshole better than anybody?!!?!?!?!
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:02 PM PDT
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Yes. And, unfortunately, after last Saturday, most of section R.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:07 PM PDT
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Oh god. The humanity!!!!
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 4:20 PM PDT
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Yes. There was quite a bit of humanity there in Section R.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:22 PM PDT
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and way too much asshole
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 4:23 PM PDT
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translation: let’s ban anyone who disagrees with us.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:02 PM PDT
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No…let’s flag borderline insane BearInsider tinfoil-hat conspiracy theorists…
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:04 PM PDT
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droski, I have no idea how long you have been at this site, but let me tell you as a Marshawnthusiast, we don’t ban. Spazzy and Thoroughbred and others might be saying some less than civil things, but I assure you unless you start making racist comments or something like that, you won’t be banned. We are open to all types of discussion here.
I just hope that we can all keep the conversation civil, OK? Some people like Longshore, others don’t fair enough. Let’s try to have reasonable arguments to back up our conclusions. Simple enough.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:06 PM PDT
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once again I don’t dislike longhsore and you guys have a great site.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:08 PM PDT
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Thank you very much for the kind words. We look forward to your continued readership.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:08 PM PDT
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Well, I’m a self-loathing Jew. Anti-semitism only makes me happy.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:12 PM PDT
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I never understood why we needed yom kippur. I’m more or less miserable every day of the year…
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:23 PM PDT
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It’s because you don’t eat enough fruit.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:24 PM PDT
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“droski, I have no idea how long you have been at this site, but let me tell you as a Marshawnthusiast, we don’t ban”
Then how come you disabled Patrick Chung’s account. I enjoyed his posts until you removed them.
CGB IS A POLICE STATE.
by BearsNecessity on
Oct 13, 2008 4:09 PM PDT
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Wasn’t our fault, Marshawn ordered us to go into BEAST MODE
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 4:11 PM PDT
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They flexed their b& hammer when I was helping with the taglines, but then they realized that without me Twist would be unchecked.
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 4:22 PM PDT
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b& hammer? I didn’t know we had one of those.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:23 PM PDT
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you need to ask yourself why you decided to sign up on this site just to accuse someone of picking favorites in his post on one play in one game
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:03 PM PDT
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TOOT TOOT
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 4:04 PM PDT
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If only i was one play in one game. someone here needs to set the record straight. If you are going to be considered the top Cal blog (which you are), you might want to try to be unbaised about Tedford and the QB situation. I have no hate for nate, but once again, lets’ not turn him into something he isn’t. Let’s let his performace speak for itself.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:06 PM PDT
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nobody is unbiased
why does bias matter in an open forum? Everybody can say whatever they want and nobody has to agree with Hydro’s post, as uncontroversial as he intended it to be. You clearly have an opinion – let the people who run this blog have theirs
by norcalnick on
Oct 13, 2008 5:24 PM PDT
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droski
This is getting absurd. I always re-watch games. I did not go through the game to find something that Longshore did better than Riley. Had Riley started and done something well, or done exactly what Longshore did on this play, I would have made the same post for him.
If I write something which can in any way be interpreted as positive or complimentary of Longshore, I have Riley-supporters and/or Longshore-haters jumping down my throat and thinking this is a huge conspiracy to advocate one QB over the other. You may think I’m being the silly and ridiculous one here, but in reality, droski, it’s you. There’s nothing wrong with wanting Riley to start, but you’re letting your belief that Riley should start color your interpretation of ANYTHING which may put Riley’s abilities in doubt or anything which might suggest that Longshore is doing something good, as a huge conspiracy of my endorsement of Longshore.
I’ve written many positive things about Riley. See my post-MSU game thoughts. See my Armed Forces Bowl analysis. I don’t care who starts – I just want wins. This isn’t a huge conspiracy, droski.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:07 PM PDT
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I never said you hate riley, just that you have repeatably parroted tedford-ese when it comes to Longshore. And frankly from a loyal reader it gets tiring. I don’t hate nate. I wish he WAS the great qb you guys think he can be or is. But the resuts have not been there.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:10 PM PDT
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Question: Who Was The Quarterback For The Victory Over Arizona State Last Saturday?
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:11 PM PDT
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Nate. And once again it was one of the worst outputs offensively in Tedford’s career. And I think we can safetly say that Tedford has better talent today than he had say in 2002 or 2003.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:12 PM PDT
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Are you going by statistics here? Which offensive output was better: Maryland ’08 or ASU ’08?
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:15 PM PDT
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I would say that Maryland ‘08 was the worse offensive output because all of those passing numbers we put up were in desperation against a prevent defense. Best and Vereen couldn’t do anything running the ball mainly because our line missed its assignments and our receivers couldn’t run precise routes in the first half. This was not Riley’s fault, just as the playcalling on the last few series of the ASU game was not Longshore’s fault
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:18 PM PDT
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Did you just answer your own question?
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:18 PM PDT
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I forgot to change my account in an effort to support my own theories. Just as a true Longshore fan would
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:19 PM PDT
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So, you are TuckNJersey!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:20 PM PDT
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Why did you stop posting!! Come back and mock me!!!
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 4:24 PM PDT
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I liked the internet a lot more when you weren’t posting and you were banned.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:24 PM PDT
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I liked the internet a lot more when you acknowledged my existence.
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 4:26 PM PDT
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That straight out made me laugh. Rec’d.
by BearsNecessity on
Oct 13, 2008 4:26 PM PDT
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Well the INT that put us in the hole that forced us to throw it 50 times was definety riley’s fault. IMO the ASU performance by Longshore was clearly superior. Put i’d hardly say that is a typical game. It’s not as though tedford has had many games like this in his career.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:21 PM PDT
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I don’t think the INT in Maryland was even Riley’s fault. The WR slipped. Had the WR not slipped, the WR might have made the catch or at least broken up the INT.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:21 PM PDT
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You are trying to trick me by using Longshore excuses for riley right? Just kidding. The fact is that the receiver wasn’t open when he released the ball. I’d say it was riley’s fault.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:26 PM PDT
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I don’t see why “The WR slipped” is a “longshore excuse.”
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:30 PM PDT
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It’s a McNabb excuse too!
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 4:31 PM PDT
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Let’s just say it is an excuse we hear a lot from fans of underperforming QBs.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:36 PM PDT
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It’s a fact. It either occurred or it didn’t occur. I, honestly, don’t remember the “The WR slipped” excuse being offered up often last year. I heard “The WR ran the wrong route” excuse, but not the slipping one.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:37 PM PDT
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Indeed. It happens with fans of stupid WRs. Todd Pinkston did it against the Patriots in the Super Bowl, DeSean did it against the Cowboys on Monday night. It’s not an excuse. It’s the truth.
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 4:40 PM PDT
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Have you ever played?

It’s tough to get a tight spiral on a turkey! HAPPY THANKGIVING HAHAHAHA LOLZ!
by zoonews on
Oct 13, 2008 5:37 PM PDT
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There’s no doubt it was far from a stellar game passing the ball, but I don’t see the value in propping Riley up at this point either. You’re right, Longshore may not be head and shoulders above Riley at this point, but you have to admit Riley was on the verge of possibly entering Ayoob/Tarvaris Jackson/JaMarcus Russell territory.
For Instance, yes, the team blew out Washington State, but are you really going to give Riley credit for 66 points when he went 6/14 for 51 yards? I’m going to go out on a limb and say no.
Longshore may not be blowing Riley out of the water, but he was on the verge of losing the job. Longshore hasn’t done anything to lose it. Yet. We’ll be the first to admit it if he does, but he hasn’t. So cut the man some slack.
Still happy over the fact that the Nets signed Ryan Anderson. Now if only they can sign Leon Powe after this year...
by yellow fever on
Oct 13, 2008 4:17 PM PDT
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There is a huge difference between being on the verge of ayoob territory and actually being in it. I would have supported benching riley if he sucked it up against CSU and then followed it by a poor say first half against ASU. But the fact is that he would have scored on 3 out of his first 4 drives against CSU if vereen and best hadn’t fumbled on back to back drives. And the game killing ints against MSU are hardly ancient history. My argument is that riley didn’t deserve to be pulled in the first place AND that nate has done nothing since to win the job.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:24 PM PDT
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I definitely don’t think he should have been replaced so soon in the CSU game… I think it would have been much more valuable if Riley stayed in past the half and tried to make adjustments. I agree with you on this.
We don’t know what Nate and Riley have done in practice to win or lose the job. THat’s why I think commenting like this (by you or me) is a little silly in that we only speculate on a lot of these things
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:27 PM PDT
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Oakanes among others said riley was outperforming nate in practice. For what that is worth. The fact is that Tedford feels comfortable with Nate and not with Riley. I don’t know why,
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:30 PM PDT
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I’m just going to point out that you’ve used the term “the fact is…” seven times, when most of the time, they weren’t, in fact, facts.
That’s a fact.
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:32 PM PDT
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You can’t blame me if you don’t know the facts.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:35 PM PDT
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lol
But the fact is that he would have scored on 3 out of his first 4 drives against CSU if vereen and best hadn’t fumbled on back to back drives.
Yes, a fact indeed. “He would have scored…”
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:42 PM PDT
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what is a fact...
is that one of the drives with a fumble had exactly one pass in it. But i’m sure the running game’s success was because RILEY IS TEH AWESOME
by norcalnick on
Oct 13, 2008 5:27 PM PDT
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droski, if you’re losing out in an argument with Spazzy, you need to re-think your drink.
Stanfurd Delendum Est.
by Olsonist on
Oct 15, 2008 8:58 PM PDT
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I read Okanes pretty closely and I’m pretty sure he’s said that they’ve both played very well in practice since the CSU game. I don’t ever remember him saying one has outperformed the other since the QB controversy arose again
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:35 PM PDT
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Okay, yeah, Thoroughbred beat me to it.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:40 PM PDT
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he said it in his weekly chat two weeks in row in response to questions. trying to look for the transcripts. . .
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:42 PM PDT
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i read those too, and I really don’t remember him saying that in either of the last two chats. I thought he said they both played very well in practice and didn’t comment further…
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:44 PM PDT
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Okanes did say that Riley was outperforming Nate in practices… but that was pre-season. That was over a month ago. When Tedford re-opened the QB competition a few weeks ago, Okanes said neither QB had stood out from one another.
To be accurate, I think we should take the latest news as fact – that neither Longshore or Riley is clearly superior to the other in practices.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:39 PM PDT
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To make it fairer
Cal should have two coin flips before ever game. One to determine possession, one to determine the starting quarterback.
by Nashville on
Oct 13, 2008 4:40 PM PDT
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Can you imagine the conspiracy theories if it came up in favor of Longshore???
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:41 PM PDT
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A contingency plan would be put in place
If it ever came up as Longshore, they would flip again. If it came up for Longshore again, then we would just run the Wild Rabid Feral Bear
by Nashville on
Oct 13, 2008 4:44 PM PDT
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I’m thinking people would say that the coin is double sided (both sides heads) and that Longshore gets to choose which side he wants and he always chooses heads.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:50 PM PDT
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no he said after the marlyand game that in his opinion from watching practice that the right qb was starting. After the CSU game he said they were both playing very well.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:43 PM PDT
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Okay, well, if those transcripts can be found and they do say that then we’ll give them to TwistNHook to admit into evidence.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:46 PM PDT
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But I’m a terrible lawyer. I’d most likely be wildly unable to get them into evidence.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:52 PM PDT
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This was Hydro’s plan the entire time, wasn’t it?
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:54 PM PDT
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Well, my failure is just getting awkward.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 5:05 PM PDT
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Wait a second
Does that mean I’m actually saying something? My roommate is a 2L and that’s all I’ve heard him talk about for the last month.
by Nashville on
Oct 13, 2008 5:07 PM PDT
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No idea. I’m a terrible lawyer.
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 5:12 PM PDT
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BTW
Thanks for the great post. I hope you continue to break down film and fill us in on the little things we may miss watching the games in real time. Your observations are very insightful, and I appreciate the work you do.
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:53 PM PDT
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thank you, Thoroughbred
I appreciate the thankful words.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:57 PM PDT
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...
Is this the part when we kiss?
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:58 PM PDT
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Sorry, I don’t kiss anyone else but Mansion.
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:59 PM PDT
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Are you telling me that the longing glance we shared before the Arizona St. game was just a tease?
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 5:13 PM PDT
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Was that the time that I yelled to Hydro “HE’S RIGHT HERE! RUN!” while pointing frantically at you?
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 5:14 PM PDT
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No. Noone understood why you did that, HydroTech clearly couldn’t hear you when he was changing plays at the line of scrimmage.
It’s times like this I wish they’d never discovered CougCenterium.
by Maharg on
Oct 13, 2008 5:33 PM PDT
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I do remember those comments after the Maryland game, but we didn’t have the controversy then. Since it was reopened, I’m almost positive he hasn’t said one has outplayed the other
...nuh nuh nuh gone
by Thoroughbred on
Oct 13, 2008 4:48 PM PDT
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Sorry I didn't keep commenting after sort of starting this fight...
I got distracted by work. And Rock Band 2.
Hydro – keep up the great analysis. I didn’t think you actually were pumping up Longshore that much (though it is easy to interpret your Peyton Manning sentence exactly the way you say it should not have been). I thought you were neutral, and I love your detailed analysis. I used “you” very casually in my post, and I really meant other people who might be slavering over Nate as starter for the rest of the season.
I just wanted to start a fight, because I feel exactly like what droski just said:
1. Riley should not have been pulled.
2. Nate has done very little, and I’m not impressed enough to give him the job.
3. I don’t have proof of what Nate is going to do, but my gut feeling is he is going to Ayoob us, and I can’t stand to watch it happen again!
4. I’d rather watch Riley screw up in a new way, then watch us lose the way we’ve lost before.
5. Of COURSE I’m happy about the win. But as a TrueBlue™, we do NOT assume we’re going to win games, we are always afraid of losing, and we don’t use the H word.
Stand the whole game, stay to the end, and start yelling while they're still in the huddle. GO BEARS
by JerrottWillard45 on
Oct 15, 2008 2:17 PM PDT
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If fancy charts mean more to you than win and losses and TDs and INTs I don’t know what to tell you.
again…
by Spazzy Mcgee on
Oct 13, 2008 4:18 PM PDT
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I never thought you said I hated Riley but if you read your posts you are CLEARLY insinuating that I’m throwing my support behind on QB over the other.
Specifically:
you need to ask yourself why you searched the entire ASU game film to find something that nate does better than kevin riley. I suggest having a few drinks and thinking a bit about that.
Is a reasonable person not supposed to interpret that as you insinuating that this post is a huge conspiracy theory?
www.californiagoldenblogs.com
by HydroTech on
Oct 13, 2008 4:16 PM PDT
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Yes. You’re clearly insinuating Brock Mansion does all the things Nate does and more.
by BearsNecessity on
Oct 13, 2008 4:18 PM PDT
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Like Party! Aboard that amazing yacht of his!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 4:20 PM PDT
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I think you’ve been defending lonshore and tedford so long at this point that it’s second nature. I have no doubt you want the best qb to play.
by droski on
Oct 13, 2008 4:18 PM PDT
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I have a suggestion
Replace the ‘Cal’ logo on your profile with the Swiss flag. Then people will understand you are neutral and they will send you their money!
by Nashville on
Oct 13, 2008 4:13 PM PDT
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I think he was comparing him to Peyton Manning solely because of all that jibbering (and also the jabbering) that Manning does up at the line of scrimmage.
Again, I think some people are missing the tree for the forest here. This is just about this one play here. Hydro’s overarching point seems to be that Longshore made these changes at the line here and that iit might show that Tedford might trust Longshore more. This doesn’t really have anything to do with 2007 or even the MSU game. Or even Riley versus Longshore.
More that just something interesting occurred in the game. Longshore made a change at the LOS, which is apparently rare, and it worked. It would have been JUST as interesting had Longshore made the change and it failed. That’s the key here. It’s not whether Longshore succeeded or not, but that he even tried in the first place!
I'm no The Maharg! But I try. Oh, how I try!
www.CaliforniaGoldenBlogs.com
by TwistNHook on
Oct 13, 2008 3:48 PM PDT
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Here's the ironic part
I would argue that the play actually did fail. The result may have been positive, but it’s not because the play worked as Nate drew it up in the metaphorical sand at the line of scrimmage. Indeed, it wouldn’t surprise me if Tedford et al., upon reviewing the film, concluded, “We’re never going to do that again.”
Go Bears!
by California Pete on
Oct 13, 2008 4:19 PM PDT
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